Scaling SaaS: how customer insights drive SaaS growth with Johannes Karjula @Trustmary

saas.unbound is a podcast for and about founders who are working on scaling inspiring products that people love, brought to you by https://saas.group/, a serial acquirer of B2B SaaS companies.

In episode #20 of season 5 of the saas.unbound podcast, Anna Nadeina sits down with Johannes Karjula, founder of Trustmary, a company dedicated to helping businesses collect, manage, and display customer reviews and testimonials. Their conversation sheds light on Johannes’s entrepreneurial journey, the evolution of Trustmary from a project-based business to a SaaS powerhouse, and the critical role of customer-led growth in scaling SaaS companies globally.

From Project Business to SaaS: Johannes’s Entrepreneurial Journey

Johannes’s entrepreneurial roots run deep, though his SaaS experience is relatively young. Trustmary’s story began in 2016 as a service business producing high-quality testimonial videos and client stories to showcase social proof for companies. However, the project-based model wasn’t scalable. Many clients wanted testimonial content but lacked the contacts of satisfied customers willing to participate.

The turning point came in 2020, amid the COVID-19 pandemic. As the project business ground to a halt—revenue dropping from hundreds of thousands to nearly zero—Johannes and his team pivoted to focus on software. They developed a piece of software internally to identify happy customers willing to provide testimonials, which became the foundation for Trustmary’s SaaS offering.

With seed investment from Vendep Capital, Trustmary launched its SaaS product in Finland in 2020, initially focusing on outbound sales. By early 2022, they introduced a premium product and began expanding internationally. Today, Trustmary serves clients in over 80 countries, ranging from micro-businesses to larger enterprises, with dedicated sales efforts in promising markets such as Germany.

The Origin and Meaning Behind the Name “Trustmary”

The name “Trustmary” came about during Trustmary’s global expansion phase, replacing their original Finnish name, which didn’t resonate internationally. Johannes wanted a name that conveyed trust and was globally recognizable. “Mary” was chosen because it is one of the most common names worldwide, making it relatable and easy to remember.

Interestingly, when combined, “Trustmary” evokes a sense of a “trust engine” or a reliable source of trusted opinions, which fits perfectly with their mission of helping companies build trust through customer voices. Johannes also noted that US friends viewed the name positively, associating it with authenticity and reliability.

Customer-Led Growth: The Heart of Trustmary’s Success

Johannes defines customer-led growth as the practice of leveraging satisfied customers’ voices to attract similar, ideal clients. Early in his career as a digital marketing entrepreneur, he noticed that adding testimonials and client stories to websites significantly improved conversion rates. He realized that testimonials from customers similar to the prospect created more relevant and trustworthy messages, increasing the likelihood of new clients converting and being satisfied.

At Trustmary, this philosophy permeates the entire organization. Every team member, from marketing to sales to customer success, is responsible for pushing customers forward and helping them derive more value. The company often provides free assistance and guidance to clients, believing that happy customers lead to retention, upsells, and referrals. This approach aligns with their ideal client profile (ICP) thinking, focusing on clients they can serve best and who will benefit most from their services.

Onboarding and Customer Research

Trustmary takes an active approach to onboarding, offering free trials and personally guiding new customers through the product. This hands-on method helps them understand customer needs and improve the product accordingly. Everyone in the company shares responsibility for advancing customers through the funnel, emphasizing collaboration across functions to optimize the customer journey.

Going Global: Iterations, Learnings, and Growth

Launching a SaaS product globally is no easy feat. Trustmary’s journey was marked by continuous iteration and learning. After launching their premium product in 2022, the company initially focused on signups but quickly realized that activation and conversion were more critical metrics. Early activation rates hovered around 8%, but through weekly iterations and improved onboarding, this rose to over 50%, driving better conversion rates.

Pricing was set deliberately low to test willingness to pay, and after about a year, Trustmary started seeing meaningful upgrades and retention. Their growth relied heavily on organic channels like SEO and Google Ads, carefully optimized to attract visitors who genuinely needed their solution. Johannes emphasizes the importance of aligning marketing efforts with activation and revenue metrics to avoid vanity metrics that don’t contribute to growth.

Integrating AI to Enhance Customer Insights

Trustmary incorporates AI features into its product to analyze customer reviews and feedback, providing actionable insights to clients about what to improve. The idea for AI integration emerged directly from customer requests—larger clients were exporting data to use their own AI tools, prompting Trustmary to build those capabilities in-house.

AI helps categorize and rank reviews automatically, enhancing the relevance of testimonials displayed on websites. The company continues to explore AI’s potential to deliver core value more efficiently, focusing on features that deepen trust and improve customer understanding rather than adding superficial functionalities.

Biggest Wins, Failures, and Lessons Learned

Johannes is candid about the many failures he has experienced, viewing them as essential learning opportunities. One of the biggest challenges was underestimating the importance of micro-failures and rapid iterations when launching the self-service SaaS product. Early on, the team expected quick traction but faced many setbacks before finding product-market fit and scaling effectively.

A key turning point was seeking advice from someone with direct experience in sales-led SaaS growth. This mentor helped Johannes prioritize tasks, focusing on a few impactful actions rather than chasing many ideas simultaneously. Johannes highlights the difficulty founders face in admitting they don’t have all the answers but stresses the importance of seeking guidance and embracing vulnerability.

He also shares a vivid metaphor comparing the startup journey to being lost in a jungle, searching for a path out. Sometimes the path is fraught with challenges, but perseverance leads to clearer roads and eventual success. This metaphor helps him communicate transparently with his team about the company’s current state and next steps.

Founder Sales and Building a Personal Brand

Johannes has gradually re-embraced his personal brand after a quiet period during the early, difficult product launch phase. Now confident in Trustmary’s product and market fit, he actively shares his experiences and insights on LinkedIn, podcasts, and other channels. While he acknowledges his personal brand currently contributes little directly to pipeline or retention, he believes that giving value generously will return benefits over time.

Practical Hacks for SaaS Founders

• Spend time with your customers: Johannes advises founders to engage directly with clients, ask questions, and build relationships rather than relying solely on automation or AI-driven templates. This hands-on approach uncovers real problems and drives faster learning.
• Use live chat and expert calls: Trustmary replaced its old chat system with a premium live chat tool that enabled real-time conversations with users. Offering free 15- to 30-minute expert sessions helped them understand user struggles and convert more effectively, especially in localized markets.
• Prioritize ruthlessly: Focus on a few high-impact tasks rather than trying to do everything at once. Seeking advice from experienced peers can help sharpen priorities and avoid wasting time on less important activities.
• Embrace failures as learning opportunities: Micro-failures are part of the journey. Testing many ideas and quickly iterating based on feedback is essential for finding product-market fit and scaling sustainably.